No.1792731
Chad pope
No.1792733
Me almost cristian
No.1792750
>Does he know he's gonna die soon or something?
Why would that be relevant? The Vatican is an absolute monarchy and popes rule for life. It's not like he has to worry about being popular with online tradcaths or some shit.
No.1792761
Does anything he says actually have an influence tho? I feel like he's been trying to cater to left-coded views because the Prots are great replacing caths everywhere so Vatican is getting scared and try anything to stop it.
I feel like he's throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks.
No.1792767
These are literally all common views in the Latin American left.
No.1792769
>>1792730Most Catholics live in South America and other Global South countries.
No.1792770
>>1792761Studied in Cristian School in brasil. ALL of the pope positions were taught, except the ukraine part
No.1792771
I guess he’s more tolerable than the last pope.
No.1792823
I had fascistas friend in highschool, and they loved tô talk shit about the pope all the time, só that was a win
No.1792824
>>1792730Most Popes have gone "le capitalism is bad" and usually argue to a "Third Way". Doesn't mean that they are Communist or revolutionary.
No.1792825
>>1792813he's reaaally sick now, hopefully we dont get an uberkkkonservative pope but that's what is most likely to happen to be fair
No.1792826
>>1792824this pope has openly talked about collaborating with socialists and has met many socialists leaders, he's obviously not a revolutionary but he's still kino imo
No.1792842
He's good. People don't really understand the mediatic power of the church, he obviously won't lead an armed revolution but he's only one of the few people of the west who can say things like this and cannot be completely ignored. Also this is particulary relevant in catholic countries, and i don't talk about south america, but also in europe.
I hope this trend continues even with the next pope. I'd really like an african pope, one who spits in the face of gardenfags and starts talking pubicly about decolonization and imperialism.
No.1792854
>>1792843U.S. Catholics never listen to the vatican when the pope says things they don’t like.
No.1792858
>>1792843I don't know, maybe because the US is a schizophrenic cesspool of reactionaries.
No.1792860
>>1792843>USThere's your answer
No.1792864
>>1792855>Change capitalism for goodblasphemy! We are the house of God not a fucking
soup kitchen small business
No.1792874
>>1792730
>Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be perfect, go, sell your possessions, and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven >it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.> Now the whole group of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one claimed private ownership of any possessions, but everything they owned was held in common>He sat down opposite the treasury, and watched the crowd putting money into the treasury. Many rich people put in large sums. A poor widow came and put in two small copper coins, which are worth a penny. Then he called his disciples and said to them, "Truly I tell you, this poor widow has put in more than all those who are contributing to the treasury. For all of them have contributed out of their abundance; but she out of her poverty has put in everything she had, all she had to live on.>Beware of the scribes, who like to walk around in long robes, and to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces, 39 and to have the best seats in the synagogues and places of honor at banquets! 40 They devour widows' houses and for the sake of appearance say long prayers. No.1792877
>>1792843my inlaws are a bunch of irish catholic americans. they may as well be prots. one of them watches ancient aliens and none of them are literate enough to read a bible on their own
No.1792900
he is autistic
No.1792906
To be honest, Pope Francis isn't saying anything that isn't already a part of Catholic economic thought, minus maybe the gays part. Historically, I would argue Religions found a role as economic regulators, whether by declaring debt jubilees, fixing prices, chastisting merchants, so on. I remember hearing a story about Imams in the Ottoman Empire, and if they uncover that a merchant is charging exorbitant prices, they would publicly chastise him and make him display Qur'anic verses on greed. Hell, even early protestants did something similar, be it through peasant revolts also price fixing (I believe some early colonists in New England publicly held trials for merchants trying to upcharge them and would confiscate their properties. Pretty much as soon as Capitalism came about, Catholicism started critiquing it, granted they argued for a kind of corporatism or distributism most of the time.
As for chastising American imperialism, I believe the father of Liberation Theology actually started as a conservative Catholic before seeing how fucking brutal Right Wing death squads were and how impoverished the people were. At his own funeral, CIA director William Casey (who worked under Reagan) was chastised by Bishop John McGann in front of Reagan himself for his role in Iran-Contra. Not to mention America (and the KKK) intervened in the Cristero war against the Catholic partisans.
No.1792942
"The men of the church, that is, those ministers or priests of various hierarchies and
denominations, represent a sector that has special ability to communicate with the
people, particularly workers, peasants, and Brazilian women. The priest who
is an urban guerrilla is a powerful ingredient in the Brazilian revolutionary war, and
constitute a powerful weapon against US military power and imperialism." Carlos Marighella, manual do guerrilheiro urbano
https://www.marxists.org/portugues/marighella/index.htm No.1792959
>>1792877>none of them are literate enough to read a bible on their ownThat's okay
, I mean it's not, but still… I'd expect no less as Catholics technically only have the bible (Septuagint) read to them. 99/100 Catholics who have read a bible have read the Prot one that's missing some gospels, Thomas for sure and I want to say Mary's too, but I can't remember offhand.
No.1793013
>>1792877>none of them are literate enough to read a bible on their ownthat's literally what catholicism is about
No.1793018
>>1793013Only atheists read the bible unironically
No.1793024
I read up to the bit in the bible where one of the apostles went on a business trip, and a bunch of grifters started an MLM scam, so the apostle had to return and tell them to knock that shit off.
No.1793038
>>1793018Some parts of it are awesome if you read it as poetry or fantasy
No.1793041
>>1793038If you are initiated into the occult you can actually read it how it is supposed to be read. What do you think the 12 tribes really mean?
No.1793052
>>1793041Wasn't there thirteen indotribes?
No.1793054
>>1793038Revelation is best read as the author getting abducted by aliens and getting shown a propaganda film of their historical conquests and political intrigues, but he doesn't understand shit because he's a bronze age primitive. Or just taking drugs.
No.1793060
>>1793054Its literally all just basic symbolism
It makes me laugh when christcuck slaves and gaytheists take that shit literally
Even engels decoded the beast with 7 heads as referring to rome's 7 hills and nero kaisar being 666
No.1793064
>>1792842Note the Pope has explicitly stated outright that the Church needs to come to terms with the abhorrent role it played in facilitating Western colonialism and much of the Holocaust
No.1793065
>>1793054>>1793060He's right
Revelation is a pretty on the nose political propaganda piece about the downfall of the Roman Empire and prevailing of Christians over Roman imperialism
There are many references to Rome and contemporary Roman politics at the time
No.1793068
>>1793052The 12 tribes are the 12 signs of the zodiac. Like the 12 disciples and the 12 gemstones on the high priest's breastplate that correspond to the 12 pathways and 12 foundations of heaven (the sky). The 4 beasts of heaven are just the fixed signs of the zodiac: aquarius (man), the bull (taurus), the lion (leo) and the eagle (scorpio). In revelation it says there are 24 thrones in heaven, which are clearly just the hours in the day.
It becomes common sense once you know.
No.1793073
>>1793065Its not just about muh politics though, its about the battle more broadly against spiritual rome, where the christian church is supposed to be spiritual israel, especially after rome sacked jerusalem. In the gospels jesus clearly divides rome against heaven in terms of its law, especially in regards to the forgiveness of debts.
No.1793101
There's an old anecdote about a CPC diplomat at the Vatican quipping with the Catholics about how similar they actually are, we have our propaganda department, you have your evangelicals, and so on. What is the difference? You are the Party of God, we are the Party of the Devil, to much laughter on both sides.
***
On the other hand, think of the power if the Catholics go pink. The Catholic Church is the original Marxist-Leninist organization, employing strict discipline alongside ideological infiltration and subversion.
Frankly, the Catholic Left is worth working with for our ends. It's fucking 1.2 billion people, including a substantial segment of the Western population. We keep the Pope on side, imagine how much subversion and sabotage we can pull off while hiding under the banner of the cross.
No.1793128
>>1792843Most I’ve known are people who would vote Democrat if it weren’t for abortion
No.1793139
Latin American Catholics: Maybe we should give this food to poor people.
US Catholics: The roman catholic church from its origins is antisemitic. Leftists are jews so catholics are anti-leftists. Catholics like nick fuentes and mel gibson prove the point, so does the fact that the vatican supported der fuhrer, all while prots worship israel and allow women and gays to be pastors..
No.1793140
>>1792843See it depends if you’re talking converts or cradle Catholics. The joke being a guy who converts to the Catholic Church will be vehemently reactionary while a dude who is born in it will think “well we should just help the poor”
I’d say even some of the more reactionary Catholics, at the very least, aren’t libertarians. Like Matt Christman once said he could at least respect freaks like Ross Douthat for recognizing that Capital is the great dissolver of traditions. It really depends on how you see the fundamental role of the church—whether its job is to try to elevate people to a kind of communalist society, or impose a strict social hierarchy.
>>1793101I think it shouldn’t be limited to Catholicism, personally. Truth be told I think Islam can be a force for good, too. Hell maybe even the Mormons can get in on it. I think the religious impulse, at least how it manifests in actual church goers, can be a collective and progressive impulse
No.1793141
>>1793133
I am not a christcuck of any kind
I reject rabbi yeshuah
No.1793142
The most reactionary type of religion in latin america is kinda the evangelical churches tbh
No.1793146
>>1793142too much showmaking and corruption and supporting ultra right wingers, too litlle actually helping the poor
No.1793155
>>1793141You're still retarded. Also this is a materialist board you fucking faggot, go brag about your mad okkvlt skills in /pol/.
No.1793156
>>1793140Mormons are a cult. Catholics, Muslims, these can be worked with, but the Mormons are basically a Western new religion that is heavily right-wing.
We've just made the most progress with the Catholics, however, and they're organized and disciplined. When Francis kicks the bucket, hopefully there's another Leftcath in charge.
If you're stuck deep in evangelical territory, if you think you can get away with it, consider converting to Catholicism and larping as a Liberation Theologian. It's better cover than the socialist movements.
No.1793158
>>1793155You will never be a wizard (YWNBAW)
No.1793348
pope franzis
No.1793532
>>1793156Mormons seem to be similar to Catholics with how much they glow; any new socialist state should probably force a patriotic schism in any of these kind of churches
No.1793600
>>1792855Dengist Pope!
Dengist Pope!
No.1793883
>>1793532>Mormons […] glowI forget where I heard it, but apparently they're prime candidates for Three Letter Agency work - typically clean sheets (good for avoiding blackmail and bribery), dedication to ideals and 'murica, missionaries have language experience, lots of pros with Mormons.
No.1793890
>>1793883and they're all teetotalers, and on top of that the missionary work they do gives them an excuse to hop around countries that doesn't look suspicious. In the 60s I think a quarter of all CIA agents were mormons. They assassinated JFK probably. Stephanie Myer, the Mormon who wrote Twilight made Catholic Vs. Mormon vampires one of the side plots… telling on herself? Camelot vs. CIA?
No.1794089
>>1793890Entire point of supporting Catholics against Mormons. We have influence and control over Catholics. Mormons, on the other hand, are a hostile cult.
No.1794093
>>1794089 But doesn't Communism come from Protestantism?
No.1794103
>>1792769And Christians know where the wind is blowing, and are proficient in being parasites on power.
No.1794108
>>1794103I’d rather sacrifice half the leftist movements in South America to leftcath in order to feed the latter to do subversion in the Global Core.
Put another way, supporting leftcaths gives us a threat on incompetent left movements in Latin America. You either deliver the results we need, that is to say, powerful and effective socialist countries, or we feed you to the leftcaths.
No.1794321
>>1794113Naw, we just go back to 2008 thinking, before the great hysteria. It's what the LGBT I know irl want too.
No.1794362
>>1794321I don't trust Christians not to fuck them over.
No.1794570
>>1794334>how did it stop?Prots got soft. In November Biden will announce the cancellation of the election and officially turn the America over to his Holiness the Pope. Following this the Inquisition will give all pr*testants a chance to recant their blasphemous views or be burned as heretics. Deus vult.
No.1809288
>>1792959Thomas and Mary are not in the catholic bible either, im pretty sure those are gnostic gospels.
No.1809302
>>1809291oh hey i liked that series, the ending was cute, i guess you prolly were the one who posted it on here
No.1841219
>>1793159The South Park guys kind of fucked up with Book of Mormon tbh. It makes the religion seem like a bunch of wholesome dorks when in reality it's a bunch of crusty old rapist cult leaders.
No.1841220
>>1792730He should tell christians to gather for a socialist revolution. At least in Italy.
No.1841243
>>1792877Hey I watch ancient aliens too its so funny
No.1841245
I wonder how Francisco Franco would react to this
No.1841248
>>1841245Franco's reaction wouldn't be that interesting it would those of the army who started coup attempted that would be really upset.
No.1841313
PR pope
No.1841331
>>1841218Why are they talking like they're absolutely psychotic, I feel like they want to rape and dismember me.
No.1841359
>>1792843US catholics are just spicy protestants
No.1841386
we should all become catholic distributists
No.1841475
>>1792730>gays are okHeresy
No.1841511
>>1792730>Does he know he's gonna die soon or something?He's clearly not afraid to die. He would be turned into a saint.
>>1841475Why are christians so obsessed with homosexuals?
No.1841556
BAZED
No.1841557
>>Says gays are okay and can get married
why is this a good thing? you know that this is the thing that caused Strasser to lose, right?
No.1841568
>>1841557Strasser getting night of the long knived is surely because of muh gays and not because of thinking Porky should have to serve the state rather than the other way around somewhat.
No.1841647
>>1841568It was both. Most The nazi's and radical RWer of the time saw both communism and "sexual dysfunction" to be part of the same anti-aryan anti-struggle agenda. The RWer understand communism as anything that is against "nature", it doesnt means economics to them like it means to us in practice.
No.1841674
>>1792877>my inlaws are a bunch of irish catholic americans. <none of them are literate enough to read a bible on their ownKek. Glad to see Catholisism really is the same even in america though!
No.1842247
Did catholic church teach african priest to hate african?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szUT8jo5mlU No.1842291
>>1792730do you know who else was "anticapitalist"? slavers and feudal lords. we are socialists, not "anticapitalist". hes a social democrat at best and a reactionary socialist at worst
>>1792826empty platitudes. plus he only met with bolivarian retards
>>1793101no, fuck off
No.1842318
They've been desperate for decades because Christianity and religion in general keep losing members.
No.1842320
>>1842291So many people here are awed at the most milquetoast "anticapitalism".
No.1842323
>>1842314yes
evo morales can fuck off. he will hang together with all pink wave socialdemocrats
No.1842331
>>1841661> Pic> Cardinal Pell MelbourneGeorge Pell wrote memo calling papacy of Pope Francis a ‘catastrophe’
Cardinal George Pell was the author of an anonymous memo condemning the papacy of Pope Francis as a “catastrophe” where political correctness held sway while global wrongs were ignored, says the journalist who published it.
Released last year under the pseudonym Demos, the document accuses the pope of silence on moral issues, including the German Catholic church’s openness to the LGBTQ community, female priests and communion for the divorced.
“Decisions and policies are often ‘politically correct’, but there have been grave failures to support human rights in Venezuela, Hong Kong, mainland China, and now in the Russian invasion." Says Pell
Pell appeared to like the more liberal-minded Francis personally, but not how he ran the church. Francis supported Pell privately during the abuse saga and on the day of the acquittal offered mass for all who suffer unjust sentences.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jan/13/george-pell-wrote-memo-calling-papacy-of-pope-francis-a-catastrophe No.1842337
>>1842320i think its the composition of leftypols userbase (mostly from the developed west), and the left wing from those countries tend to support 21th century socialism which was just redwashing and fucked us over
No.1842343
>>1842337It doesn't help that mods actively delete and ban anything that is perceived as "ultra-leftism" by their pseud asses, but posting about how the Pope is le /ourguy/ XD is totally fine.
No.1842351
>>1842343>It doesn't help that mods actively delete and ban anything that is perceived as "ultra-leftism" by their pseud asses, but posting about how the Pope is le /ourguy/ XD is totally fine.Btw, you talk a lot about your ban for posting "marxism", could you screenshot the post that you made that got you banned?
No.1842352
>>1842351nta but i got banned (against the rules mind you) for not supporting transgenderism
No.1842356
>>1842351Anything against campism gets you banned for "spam".
>>1842352Very funny. That isn't even related to marxism or socialism in general.
No.1842357
>>1792826>socialists leadersXD
No.1842361
>>1842356i know. i wasnt even being transphobic just disagreeing in a debate
No.1842368
>>1842357<socialist leaders> XDhttps://www.vaticannews.va/en/pope/news/2024-01/marxists-and-christians-to-fight-together-corruption-illegality.htmlPope encourages Marxists and Christians to fight corruption, uphold rule-of-lawPope Francis reiterated the centrality of the vulnerable as well as the urgency of countering the triple "scourge" of corruption, abuse of power, and lawlessness—both in politics and in society—in his address on Wednesday with representatives of the DIALOP transversal dialogue project.
This is a dialogue project between socialists/Marxists, communists, and Christians aimed at formulating a common social ethic that can be proposed as a new narrative for a Europe in search of its identity, with an integral ecology between the Social Doctrine of the Church and Marxist social critique at its core.
"Do not stop dreaming"
Pope Francis received this morning, in the Paul VI Hall, before the General Audience, 15 members—7 from the left and 8 Catholics from different European countries—of this association.
He shared with them his pain for a world that today appears "divided by wars and polarizations" and, on the other hand, his encouragement to look to the future and try to imagine a "better world."
"We Argentinians say: don't wrinkle, don't go backwards. And this is the invitation I extend to you too: don't back down, don't give up, don't stop dreaming of a better world."
Freedom, equality, dignity, fraternity
"It is in the imagination, in fact, that intelligence, intuition, experience, and historical memory meet to create, venture, and risk," the Pope stressed.
He recalled how, over the centuries, "it has been the great dreams of freedom and equality, of dignity and fraternity, a reflection of God's dream, that have produced progress and advances."
In this sense, the Pope indicated three attitudes for DIALOP to carry out its commitment: the courage to break the mould, attention to the weak, and promotion of a culture based on the rule-of-law.
No.1842371
"Beyond religious and ideological boundaries, Christians and Marxists, as well as people of good will," the association explained in a note, "recognise today that they are united in their commitment to the end of armed conflicts in the world and the security of the most basic human rights, in order to guarantee social equilibrium and peace for humanity."
No.1842376
>>1842368>promotion of a culture based on the rule-of-lawOh and I didn't even get to the worst part.
No.1842395
>>1842368oh wow
amazing
incredible
his political representative in his home country is a bourgeois fuckhead who lives off from "contributions" made from the poorest fragment of the proletariat
dont even get me started on that guy, the things he does and did in this place are shameful
its unbelievable how gullible you people are
No.1842401
>>1842395Milei? What milei has to do with the pope though? Because they are both argentinians?
No.1842406
>>1842401no his name is juan grabois
No.1842420
>>1842331Nothing about the Damos letter is contradictory to what I said.
They were personal friends with the pope actively supporting Pell strongly as well as supporting other sexsually abusive clergy. Cope.
No.1842436
>>1842406From what i got of this "Juan Grabois" man, he was a former member of the "Vatican Dicastery for Promoting Integral Human Development". Did not find anything particular absurd about him, if you know an article about a polemic involving him, please post.
"Two days ago, Juan Grabois appeared in the Argentine press to comment on the Pope's surprise at the millionaire donation made by President Macri's government to the pontifical foundation Scholas Occurrentes, a network of schools for the meeting promoted by the Catholic leader himself."
“Anyone who thinks that by giving money, especially public resources, to a foundation, school, NGO, cooperative or popular movement for the simple fact of being directly or indirectly linked to the Pope is making a 'gesture to Francis' is truly an idiot, in addition to corrupt and prevaricating”, said the lawyer dryly to the newspaper Página/12 (01-06-2016)."
"And he had no doubts in pointing out: “If the State finances an organization, it must be because of its ability to improve the reality of the people of the Nation. Scholas performs an enormous task in Argentina and throughout the world and that is why it deserves support from the State. But presenting it as a favor to the Pope is barbaric and something that he would in no way accept on those terms. You can see that they don’t know Francisco.”
https://ihu.unisinos.br/sobre-o-ihu/78-noticias/579825-quem-e-juan-grabois-consultor-do-papa-francisco-cuja-visita-a-lula-foi-vetadaSo was he a corrupt politician? from "contributions" i assume is because he was corrupt.
This guy was also a He was a precandidate for president of Argentina for the Unión por la Patria in the 2023 Argentine primary elections, being defeated by Sergio Massa of the Renewal Front by a large margin.
19-year old Grabois founded the Movimiento de Trabajadores Excluidos (MTE; "Excluded Workers' Movement"), seeking to group the waste pickers who suffered persecution from by Buenos Aires Police as their activities were outlawed, in order to organize collective action for their right to work. The MTE also incorporated other groups of informal sector workers, such as small agricultural workers, recuperated businesses workers, street vendors, among others.
Also a founder of the “CGT of the precarious”, a reference to the General Confederation of Labor, the historic acronym of trade union representation in Argentina, although Grabois himself is very critical of organized gremialism which, in his view, turned its back on the workers. Therefore, its confederation already has more than 80 thousand members, including salespeople, workers from recovered factories, bikers, peasants, leaflet deliverers and beneficiaries of the Argentina Works Plan.
In 2005, he participated in the promulgation of Law 1.854, or "Ley de Basura Cero" ("Spanish: Zero-waste law"), guaranteeing the inclusion of scrap workers' rights into the legislation's text.
In 2008, the cardinal celebrated a public mass with carneiros and precarious people with the motto “For a homeland without slaves or excluded people”. The ceremony was repeated year after year without interruption until 2012.
The bond remained between Grabois and the new Pope. In this way, an unprecedented meeting was created, the first World Meeting of Popular Movements held in October 2014 in the Vatican. An event that brought together representatives from dozens of countries and ended with a strong speech from the pope centered on three words that are already a motto of the pontificate: land, roof and work.
“Francisco accused (without naming him) neoliberalism of being the cause of many of the current evils: ‘All this occurs – he stated – when human beings are removed from the center of the system and money is placed in their place’. ‘That’s why you need to raise your voice,’ he repeated. And he recalled that ‘Christians have a program that I would dare to describe as revolutionary: the beatitudes of the Sermon on the Mount of the Gospel According to Saint Matthew’”, writes French journalist Ignacio Ramonet.
From Glowipedia, there is only 2 languages, spanish and english.
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Graboishttps://ihu.unisinos.br/noticias/536859-encontro-mundial-de-movimentos-populares-impressoes-de-uma-jornada-historicaI will not copy pasted more, i think this is enough, you guys can see the sources for yourselfs
>>1842420Well, the Pope has made bad friends once, but not we all?
This is a very unfunny joke, but Stalin also had a lot of friends, who later were discovered to be reactionaries and traitors. That doesn't make Stalin a reactionary, right?
Your "friends" and "allies" don't define your ideas. Specially if those reactionary friends are the vast minority of your friends.
No.1842485
>>1842436dont be fooled by his petty charity. hes an absolute piece of shit. ill elaborate when i get home
can you read spanish?
No.1842489
>>1842485>can you read spanish?Yes, don't worry
No.1842539
>>1792906Gods or temples weren't strictly necessary. Before religions declared debt jubilees on a periodic basis, kings would traditionally wipe the slate clean upon ascension to the throne, and from time to time when emergencies (drought, etc) called for it. And when has rabbinical Judaism last let a Jubilee year happen anyway?
No.1842545
>>1842542Do I need to quote-mine Marx, Engels, and Lenin on people like Proudhon, Lassalle, Bakunin, the Narodniks, etc. just to prove my point?
No.1842555
>>1842368what ya'll think a material reason for the pope to be courting marxists like this would be? Ofc maybe thats just his honest opinion but I have to imagine there's other reasons that the pope was just like "yeah commies are cool ig" out of nowhere. Maybe its just to co-opt it or somesort gesture of goodwill towards states with explicitly marxist governments like Cuba or China; I honestly have no fucking clue
No.1842562
>>1842555he's from LatAm so probably has more than a passing familiarity with pink tide style leftism. of course he's partly just trying to modernise the church though, if I was to be generous to him I would say he probably prefers liberation theology to American style prosperity gospel heresy.
No.1842563
>>1842403>>1842555>>1842545I agree. There is no such thing as "good-will". Politics is all about co-opting the people for their own purposes. Maybe they really are desperate because their movement is losing members by the day. Which is a good thing. Is better to have a ""progressive"" pope then the rest of popes we had before.
I really can't think of a single pope that tried so much to challenge the old beliefs of christianity and the church in modern times. For good. And i am pretty sure that there will not be a more ""progressive"" pope in the next century.
For the "material conditions" of the pope doing that, i believe is because in Latin America, the place where christianity is stronger, is also the place where the pink-tide has governed for decades. And since the right-wing governments of Latin america have been nothing but military dictatorships controlled by foreigner American businessmen and military puppets, the church has much more roots as a popular movement then in other places. The "messianic" character of religion for the masses plays a great role in the popular imaginary of politics.
>>1842562basically what this other anon said.
No.1842565
>>1842436>IntegralThat word has a special meaning in political Catholicism, referring to the unity of church and state. One should be very careful with the social principles they see fit to produce, considering their track record and their age.
>integral ecology between the Social Doctrine of the ChurchThat sounds bad. They're trying to merge their fertility cult into Marxism. Run, don't walk.
>>1842545No but I sure hoped you'd highlight the parts about capitalism that were instead hidden by the Francis picture. That presentation makes you look like a conservative capitalist or reactionary failson bitching about the other team and I'd have to laugh about that.
No.1842567
>>1842565>That word has a special meaning in political Catholicism, referring to the unity of church and state.Damm, did not know that. Yikes
No.1842595
>>1792730Because he's not from E*r*pe.
No.1842617
>>1842565>No but I sure hoped you'd highlight the parts about capitalism that were instead hidden by the Francis picture.It's not that hard to highlight problems with capitalism and try to offer a solution to it. The problem is that he's not gonna offer an effective solution to it. Marx already made this point:
>Nothing is easier than to give Christian asceticism a Socialist tinge. Has not Christianity declaimed against private property, against marriage, against the State? Has it not preached in the place of these, charity and poverty, celibacy and mortification of the flesh, monastic life and Mother Church? Christian Socialism is but the holy water with which the priest consecrates the heart-burnings of the aristocrat.When push comes to shove, he's gonna give up all that socialist larping. And letting a religious figure have influence over the socialist movement would surely be a grave form of opportunism.
No.1842898
>>1842436>Well, the Pope has made bad friends once, but not we all? >This is a very unfunny joke, but Stalin also had a lot of friends, who later were discovered to be reactionaries and traitors. That doesn't make Stalin a reactionary, right? >Your "friends" and "allies" don't define your ideas. Specially if those reactionary friends are the vast minority of your friends.That's an insane perspective.
We're talking about accused and convicted child abusers, as well as those who systematically enabled, legally obstructed and obfuscated to hide these crimes for decades.
Fuck off.
No.1842915
Have you an statement about the Pope in specific, the nature of his actions, and a description of his character?
No.1842942
>>1842563Supposedly Francis is the last pope according to prophecy. He, or the next one, will be a caretaker of his flock until Rome is destroyed, or something like that.
>>1842930So goes the glory of managerialism.
No.1842953
>>1792750Theocratic monarcho-socialist absolutism ftw
No.1842954
>>1792824Le trads, romantics and reactionaries were always "le capitalism is bad" though
The only exception being the USA that has liberals for conservatives and idolises the bourg
No.1842957
>>1792842There is a black cardinal in line. Uber trad.
No.1842961
>>1792858>a schizophrenic cesspool of liberalsftfy
No.1842964
>>1842957Tokenism is a long-standing imperial tradition, lad
No.1842966
>>1842961The only problem with liberalism is that, in the present time under present conditions, it is an ideology of reaction.
No.1842968
>>1792877>watches ancient aliens>read a bible Same thing
No.1842969
>>1793013thats what i was gonna say lol
No.1842977
>>1842966Not really
The US is a constant histrionic bitch fest between muh based lolbert classical liberals and muh redpilled progressive liberals
There is no authentic right or left in the US and now they've turned the entire West into a reflection of that
I would unironically view enlightened despotism as preferable to either of these cringe plutocratic positions
No.1842979
>>1793013>>1793018Reading the Bible is the quickest way to lose your faith in any Abrahamic faith but prots and jews are slow learners
No.1842982
>>1842979“How do you tell a catholic? Well, it’s someone who reads the Bible. And how do you tell an anti-catholic? It’s someone who understands the Bible.” ― Ronald Reagan
No.1842984
>>1842982talking a lot of shit for someone in inquisition range
No.1842989
>>1793054St John of Patmos literally wrote it on an island covered in magic mushrooms
He was off his tits
>>1793060Jerusalem has 7 hills to
666/616 does = Nero
>>1793068Astrotheology
>>1793142You don't know what reactionary means
>>1842565Socialism with Integralist Characteristics
No.1843830
>>1843515I don't see the problem here
No.1843832
>>1843830The problem is that same sex marriage still is not officially allowes by the church
Hope that chances soon. The pope could do more about It, but that is not the case
No.1843834
>>1843832Why is that an issue? Why would the Church do that? It doesn't make any sense for them to do that. Gay marriage is just a liberal bullshit cause.
No.1843839
>>1843834Ok man now you are baiting lol
No.1843842
>>1843839Seriously, why should the Catholic church be obliged to change its definition of marriage to appease pissy non-Catholics so that a minority that is neither religious nor that interested in Catholic marital standards can get married? Nobody is asking for this. Its unnecessary and helps nobody.
No.1843844
>>1843839Marriage is a bourgeois relation. According to Engels, it is the other side of prostitution. It would be better to unrecognize it entirely. According to Engels, that's probably the way we're headed.
No.1843847
>>1843844Let me preface that I'm willing to be berated.
Sounds great for women and tiny minority of men.
No.1843862
>>1792730>holy man actually cares about the poorIm not convinced but critical support.
No.1843867
>>1843844Engels didn't know shit about history. He pulled half of that shit out of his ass. Marriage as we know it in the West evolved out of Catholic traditions. The Catholic church institutionalized marriage and restricted divorce while phasing out Roman style concubinage to protect women and prevent men from getting girls pregnant and running off leaving the girl and the child destitute. Marriage was a conservative institution meant to tie people down and cushion the woman while enforcing a monogamous model of family life on the couple that restricted sexual behavior. This is why gay marriage makes no sense. Gays and lesbian couples don't get pregnant. There's no need to cushion the inferior or subordinate partner, there are already mechanisms through which these couples can enjoy inheritance rights etc. In fact, most queers don't want to marry or are in marriages that are open relationships, in direct violation of church teachings on monogamy. Catholic theology is asexual and promotes celibacy. Sex should only exist for procreation and marriage is a sacrament that acts as a vessel for pro-creation i.e. marriage is a necessary evil in a fallen world. Endorsing gay marriage runs entirely counter to Catholic teaching. Its utterly pointless because very few queer couples are interested in Catholic style marriage and can't procreate without IVF or adoption, effectively meaning marriage is utterly redundant waste of time.
No.1843885
>>1843847If you need spooks like marriage to bind women to you as your experience property in the first place then it really doesn't matter one way or another for you.
No.1843896
>>1843885Didn't know marraige was a one way relation like that.
No.1843929
>>1843832>supporting religious and bourg notions of legal contract monogamy>crying about non forthcoming blessings and approvals from priestsLiberals. Lmao.
No.1843932
>>1843862>critical support for vaticanRoflmfao
>>1843885Chad having harem of voluntary women is eugenic-leninist?
No.1843994
>>1843867I was talking about marriage in general. In the specifically Catholic case I agree with that portrayal of the Church's perspective. These days, with little potential for property ownership and no particular individual responsibility to reproduce the species (on average, other people take care of that), there isn't much point.
But, if there is an arc over history in the form of a law of human social development, the study of marriage as we don't know it today might help reveal it.
>>1843847It really depends on the expectations that you have set for the relationship. Under present material conditions in the industrialized countries, there isn't any particular reason for a relationship with a single breadwinner role to necessarily seat a man in that role. And women do have more power in interpersonal relationships, in part because girls, especially but not only of the upper and middle strata, are being raised to assume leadership roles, but also in part because they can participate in the bulk of possible economic activities on approximately equal terms to men, which makes the ideal genders less dependent on one another, and relationships less binding and "serious". Some people find that tragic; others do a materialism and make history with what they got. The increasing intensity of labor power exploitation may find its social correlate in the intensity of relationships, which is something opinion writers have observed and I have seen in my travels, and that seems likely to carry over into lower phase
anarchists may skip this step and possibly, with amendments, through into the higher phase.
For now, as the mode of personality shifts "from status to contract", consent culture provides one set of tools by which individuals can negotiate and renegotiate the nature and conditions of their own relations just as they have a mind; importantly, through the act of deliberate negotiation, people also debug their own desires and locate self-contradictions so they can be handled productively. The better the real sexual vanguard (not scenesters) design these relations, live them, and propagate them, the less likely that tragic flaws will make personal relationship forms and mores more noxious than is necessary.
No.1846789
>>1844029The world today is anywhere from 3x to 4x less religious than it was at the turn of the 20th century and yet socialism is even weaker than it was during a time of intense religious prejudice. Coincidence?
No.1846811
>>1846789Proof that Islamism will be the true to socialism
No.1846851
>>1846789Socialist projects have heretofore styled themselves as religions in everything but name. Maybe standing too close to God when he was killed wasn't the brightest idea.
No.1846937
>>1792843The US is not a country. It is a flea market where the slimiest satanists win the rat race. Imagine the US as the pit from the Dark Knight Rises except Christian Bale doesn't throw down the rope after escaping. And multiply that by like 300 million. Americans' biggest enemy are other Americans who dream of being the elites. I know it. Because Im surrounded by QAnon retards that tell me how jealous they are of Gates and Epstein and all the naughty things they would do if they were them. It's a mircale what booze can do to an average Qtard.
>>1793883>>1793890True. The Feds mostly recruit from Mormons. One thing I never understood is why russia banned Jehovah's witnesses but doesn't do anything about mormons when everyone knows they're legit spooks.
No.1846947
>>1846915
jannies please DO NOT perma ban him. make him suffer
No.1846948
>>1792843because it is the US
No.1846967
>>1846915
Don't forget
You're here forever
No.1846979
>>1792843American caths havent existed for a long time. Most are Sedes (see protestant) and openly reject papal authority.
No.1847077
>>1847022He was begging to be banned like a schizo. I think it went along the lines "please permaban me permaban me permaban me permaban me permaban me* or something like that.
Unique IPs: 73